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Posted By : crystalwizard - 3/30/2008 8:49 PM

so what would you say?

If the owner(s) of Random House or Harper-Collins decided put their own book, are they self-publishing?

Why... or why not?

Posted By : erazmus - 3/31/2008 6:25 AM

Well, they are publicly held, or at least subsidiaries of publicly held corporations.
Aand if their chief operating officer wrote a book, who else would they let publish it?
Mike

Michael D. Turner
"Psyched Up" in _Turn the other Chick_-ed. E. Friesner-Baen books
www.baen.com
"Dutchman Rescue"in Continuum SF #6
www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm

"An Incident at Black Tongue Tavern" in _Bash Down the Door and Slice Open the Badguy_ from Fantasist Enterprises:

www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php
"Stains" in Tales of the Talisman 3-1 www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html
"Morning Coffee" in Every Day Fiction
www.everydayfiction.com/morning-coffee-by-michael-d-turner/
"The Jewel Below" in Flashing Swords
flashingswords.sfreader.com/issues/issue8/vol2-iss8-05.htm
"Happy Landings" in Every Day Fiction
www.everydayfiction.com/happy-landings-by-michael-d-turner/
"Teller of Tales" in Every day Fiction
www.everydayfiction.com/teller-of-tales-by-michael-d-turner/
Read "Silver Shells" In Every Day Fiction
www.everydayfiction.com/silver-shells-by-michael-d-turner/

Posted By : crystalwizard - 3/31/2008 1:36 PM

But that doesn't answer the question.

Would their books be considered 'self-published' or not in that case?

Never meddle in the affairs of a wizard unless you are soggy and hard to light!

Managing Editor of Flashing Swords

Visit my art gallery on art wanted
All my books in print

Posted By : Gustavo - 3/31/2008 1:55 PM

Don't think so. Random house is an established press. Though it might technically BE self published, it's unlikely to be stuck with that label by bookstores or the general public who don't know or care who owns the company. They just know the book by such-and-such comes from Random house (or whoever).

Visit my livejournal! http://bondo-ba.livejournal.com/

Posted By : erazmus - 3/31/2008 1:56 PM

No, it wouldn't. Just the way it is.
An associate publisher would prepare the bosses book, a senior editor work with him on it. Entirely different from self-publishing.
Mike

Posted By : Swashbuckler - 3/31/2008 2:02 PM

I guess it would technically BE self-published, but it would be able to pole vault right over all the disadvantages and stigma associated with self-published work.

Steve Goble

Visit my blog, Swords Against Boredom, for news on published fiction and upcoming stories.

Posted By : RHFay - 3/31/2008 3:16 PM

This is speculation here, but I agree with the others that say it wouldn't be seen as self-published. And that's really the question about self-publishing, isn't it? - the appearance of something as self-published may give it a stigma that something that lacks that appearance doesn't have, even if it technically is self-published.

To put it another way - they could probably get away with it without suffering any "ill effects", if you know what I mean.

"I'm going to do what the warriors of old did. I'm going to recite poetry!"

Richard H. Fay - Azure Lion Productions

http://azurelionproductions.com

Posted By : H.P. Lovesauce - 3/31/2008 4:30 PM

So if I were to publish RH, and he were to publish me, we'd only have to face the problems an "ordinary" small press does? (As if that weren't a huge pile.)

Posted By : crystalwizard - 3/31/2008 6:26 PM

My next question is:

If the publisher in question, be it the CEO of random house, or H.P Lovesauce, is seen as doing a good thing to spend his money to publish someone else, why is that publisher seen as doing a bad thing to spend his money to publish himself?

And, to go along with that, why is it assumed that if the publisher who spends his money on someone else is smart and knows a good thing when he sees it, but yet is seen as stupid and doing something criminal when he spends his money on himself?

Never meddle in the affairs of a wizard unless you are soggy and hard to light!

Managing Editor of Flashing Swords

Visit my art gallery on art wanted
All my books in print

Posted By : Jordan Lapp - 3/31/2008 6:27 PM

This exact situation came up when the editor/owner of Hard Case Crimes (might have got that wrong) got nominated for an Edgar (the MWA equivalent of a Hugo). It was a respectable press AND he was a respectable author who'd PREVIOUSLY won an Edgar... but because he was owner/publisher, he was disqualified. I'll find a link sometimes when I'm not so busy at work.

Jordan Lapp

Managing Editor

Every Day Fiction

Posted By : DAWaverly - 3/31/2008 7:21 PM

Just some observations about some self-published works that I have read...
In many cases the writer, editor and publisher are all the same person. Even with good intentions, the self-publisher may be blind to problems with the work do to being to close to it (not seeing blatant error a fresh pair of eyes might see, etc.).
For some authors this would not be a problem. Why self-publish if they can sell to other markets? But the self-publisher is--or at least seems to me to be--more of a novice than not. This is the main thrust of the stigma of self-publishing as I see it. Novice is over anxious to be published and cuts corners (self-publishes) when they are not really ready to be published.

However, that stigma clings to even the experienced writer that self-publishes excellent work. The ol' fox guarding the hen-house thingy...

To me the answer is simple, and difficult.
If a publisher wishes to publish their own work then they should have an independent editor. And by independent I mean one that is not going to be afraid of pissing off the boss by rejecting a story. George Schithers rejected stories written by Isaac Asimov that were submitted for Isaac Asimov's SF Magazine. That is the kind of editor that is needed. If the editor is less sure of themselves or is afraid of angering the boss then the writer/publisher could go a long way in assisting with this by submitting under a pseudonym. I think it is great that some people can wear all three hats: writer, editor, publisher. Wearing all three hats at the same time is just asking for trouble. Intentional and unintentional corner cutting is not at issue. How truly objective can one be about ones own work?

- Deven
Blogtide Rising

published
"The Journey" at Every Day Fiction

forthcoming
"An Awakening of Shadows" in The Infinity Swords anthology
"All That Glitters" at Every Day Fiction

Posted By : Anaconda - 4/1/2008 12:51 PM

The assumption that all publishers invest a great deal of time and money to the editorial process does not always apply.

At one time, I had a publisher who added more errors than he removed.

Alec Anaconda, author of “Slaves of Janice”, “After Janice” and “Extreme Vengeance”.

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