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SFReader Forums > SF Fiction and Art > Right Now I'm Reading.... > Worm Ouroboros, Chapter 17 & 18

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Nathan Jerpe
Acolyte

Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 219

Posted 3/19/2008 9:13 PM (GMT -4)

So Chapter XVII has some of the best falconry I've read since The Once and Future King.

How can we not like a king who gives his eagle "the last wolf's lights and liver to gorge herself withal?"

In these Chapters too we see another instance of a character's writing, this time by Corsus. Anybody have any insight into what Eddison is up to with these correspondences? The spelling in them is worse than John Donne's.

I also noticed the use of (what I think are) roman numerals in the text, talk of "x or xi Daemouns schyppes", for example. But I noticed some of these numerals have j's in them, such as "Here with xxvij schyppes...". So is the 'j' commonly used in roman numerals, then?

http://roguelikefiction.com

Bill Ward
Biblioholic

Date Joined Jul 2006
Total Posts : 1635

Posted 3/19/2008 9:56 PM (GMT -4)

I think the old school spelling is just to indicate the other wordlyness/timelyness of the setting, since its a pseudo-late medieval renaissance setting we get the renaissance spelling.

I think (guess) the 'j' may just be an 'i with a tail' used at the end of multiple 'i's' as a visual thing.

I enjoyed these chapters more than the previous ones, good stuff.

billwardwriter.com

Nicholas
Adept

Date Joined Jun 2006
Total Posts : 977

Posted 3/21/2008 4:41 PM (GMT -4)

I have fallen woefully behind...

http://ozment.livejournal.com

http://manning.coldfusionvideo.com

www.myspace.com/ozmentshouseoftwilight

Nathan Jerpe
Acolyte

Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 219

Posted 3/21/2008 5:21 PM (GMT -4)

All the threads for the older chapters are still fair game, post there if you like!

I often refer back to previous chapters anyway, seeing as how this book is kinda complicated...

http://roguelikefiction.com

Nik
Adept

Date Joined Feb 2007
Total Posts : 763

Posted 3/23/2008 2:21 AM (GMT -4)

These chapters told me two things: Gorice thinks of his army purely in terms of money, and Eddison will continue to throw in anachronistic similes (anyone catch the reference to a tennis ball?). These chapters were also a tad boring (other than the hunt), but 19 and 20 are looking better...

Nicholas Ian Hawkins

Forthcoming
"Knowledge and Dust," in Magic & Mechanica, from Ricasso Press, Spring 2008

Published
"What Heroes Leave Behind," in Return of the Sword, Flashing Swords Press, March 2008
"The Weald Maiden's Will," in Every Day Fiction, March 5, 2008
"Relativity," in FLASHSHOT, September 28, 2007

Visit my website, Trampler of Beautiful Phrases, at nihawkins.wordpress.com

Bill Ward
Biblioholic

Date Joined Jul 2006
Total Posts : 1635

Posted 3/23/2008 3:20 AM (GMT -4)

I believe tennis dates from the late middle ages and definitely by the renaissance (henry VIII had a tennis court), so it isn't an anachronism.
I haven't noticed the other anachronisms, actually.

billwardwriter.com

Nathan Jerpe
Acolyte

Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 219

Posted 3/23/2008 11:53 AM (GMT -4)

I was wondering about the tennis reference.

Of course, shaving somebody like a tennis ball and painting them yellow IS an anachronism, an old college fraternity trick invented by John Belushi, I believe it was.

http://roguelikefiction.com

James Enge
Maker

Date Joined Jan 2006
Total Posts : 207

Posted 3/23/2008 4:26 PM (GMT -4)

I liked the hunt, too, but I guess I enjoyed Ch. 18 more than most of you guys did. I liked the slow developing disaster of Corsus' incompetence, and how carefully Eddison represents the difference between what people report about a war and the war itself.

It's interesting that Prezmyra stays high in Gorice's esteem, even though she opposes him in some things, and that he's done with Sriva once he's done with her. Not all these women are created equal, and none of them are created identical.

James Enge
http://jamesenge.com/

"A Covenant with Death" in Flashing Swords
"The Lawless Hours" in Black Gate 11
"The Gordian Stone" in Every Day Fiction
"The Red Worm's Way" forthcoming in Return of the Sword
"Payment in Full" forthcoming in Black Gate

Nik
Adept

Date Joined Feb 2007
Total Posts : 763

Posted 3/23/2008 9:49 PM (GMT -4)

Bill Ward said...
I believe tennis dates from the late middle ages and definitely by the renaissance (henry VIII had a tennis court), so it isn't an anachronism.
I haven't noticed the other anachronisms, actually.

That's what I thought, initially, but I did a little research. Modern tennis started in the UK in the late 19th. In the middle ages there were racquet and court games played at monasteries, but the balls were wooden or leather stuffed with bran. He was describing the tennis ball as smooth, which to me suggests a modern tennis ball.

But I was just pointing it out to be a nit-picker. Even some of the greatest authors have used glaring anachronisms (remember the clock tower chiming in Julius Ceasar?), with little detriment to the work itself.

I'm trying to remember other anachronisms I pointed out earlier, but none come to mind.

Bill Ward
Biblioholic

Date Joined Jul 2006
Total Posts : 1635

Posted 3/23/2008 11:33 PM (GMT -4)

Shakespeare was great for anachronisms...it was his mention of tennis balls in Henry V that had me look up the history of tennis years ago in the first place. Although, as he doesn't describe their texture, I suppose he was safe on that one.

billwardwriter.com

Nathan Jerpe
Acolyte

Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 219

Posted 3/24/2008 10:04 AM (GMT -4)

James Enge said...
I liked the hunt, too, but I guess I enjoyed Ch. 18 more than most of you guys did. I liked the slow developing disaster of Corsus' incompetence, and how carefully Eddison represents the difference between what people report about a war and the war itself.

I liked Chapter 18 too, I just felt the need to slow down during Corsus's report. I didn't recognize his writing to be 16th century English; I was more under the impression it was some dialect that Eddison had made up.

I remember thinking not to trust Corsus's words, but then I figured we mightn't trust Lord Gro's words either.

This got me to wondering about lies as a plot device, and how there are sure to be lots of stories out there where "the lie" is central to the narrative. But I haven't been able to think of any examples yet.

http://roguelikefiction.com

Nik
Adept

Date Joined Feb 2007
Total Posts : 763

Posted 3/24/2008 11:47 AM (GMT -4)

Nathan Jerpe said...
I liked Chapter 18 too, I just felt the need to slow down during Corsus's report. I didn't recognize his writing to be 16th century English; I was more under the impression it was some dialect that Eddison had made up.

I remember thinking not to trust Corsus's words, but then I figured we mightn't trust Lord Gro's words either.

This got me to wondering about lies as a plot device, and how there are sure to be lots of stories out there where "the lie" is central to the narrative. But I haven't been able to think of any examples yet.

The weird dialect in the letters threw me off, too, though I've seen other British authors from as recently as the 1950s use the 'j' as the last 'i' in Roman numerals.

I also did not trust what Corsus said, but I took everything Gro said at face value. Interesting.

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