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T A Markitan
aka Wicked



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   Posted 4/30/2008 9:59 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Jordan Lapp said...
Really? You haven't heard of "What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas"?


And like a trip to Vegas, that stay is temporary.
Ten years down the road, when the lies he spun about his "business trip" have faded from his memory, the wife will randomly ask a question about it, and he will give the wrong answer. Then she will nail his hide to the wall. :p


I do horrible things to punctuation.

"careful what you wish
you may regret it
careful what you wish
you just might get it"
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MysticWino
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   Posted 4/30/2008 9:51 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Only when you don't bring it home with a need for antibiotics . . .


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Jordan Lapp
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   Posted 4/30/2008 9:25 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
What's awesome is that I'm coming across as a COMPLETE pig in this thread, and I'm so totally not.


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crystalwizard
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   Posted 4/30/2008 9:24 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Jordan Lapp said...
Really? You haven't heard of "What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas"?


since when does it stay in Vegas?
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Jordan Lapp
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   Posted 4/30/2008 9:21 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Really? You haven't heard of "What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas"?


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crystalwizard
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   Posted 4/30/2008 9:19 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
MysticWino said...
What are the moral implications? Is he cheating on his wife if he allows himself to be seduced? Does it make him despicable?


If you're setting his home planet to be our earth, then yes he's cheating. Unless his marriage vows included a clause about 'as long as neither party is more than x number of miles away from the other' or something like that. As far as I know, there aren't any real vows from our planet that give an out if you happen to be seperated by space or time (or altered dimensions) from the other party. just if they die.


now, if his home planet isn't our earth, then it's up to you what his vows to his wife entailed.
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RHFay
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   Posted 4/30/2008 7:55 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
The way I see it, you have to ask yourself if the character would see giving in to temptation as being immoral to the point of resisting.  You could also have him give in, but carry the guilt with him.  It could be used for character development.
 
After all, isn't it all about the story?
 
 


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Rob Mancebo
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   Posted 4/30/2008 7:34 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
MysticWino said...
 Of course, they might accidently drug themselves playing with alchemy . . .
 
-  Now I think you could have loads of fun with that senario.


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Rob Mancebo
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   Posted 4/30/2008 7:32 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
MysticWino said...

Why is he avoiding the fairer sex?     To avoid the temptation to sleep with them – actually to keep from objectifying them. >

 

 
-  A quick(old) story:  
 
A pair of monks came to a swift river crossing where a girl was sitting, unable to cross.  The older Monk carried the girl across, blessed her, and continued on his way with his young fellow following along.  Some way down the road, the young monk--much troubled by what he'd seen--asked his mentor why he'd picked up the girl when they were bound to avoid contact with women.  
 
The elder monk replied,  "That was simple charity.  Yet I put her down upon the bank of the river, why are you still carrying her?"  
 
-  A true mystic deals with problems. 
 
 

How long was he married before he was displaced?       Does it matter how long? He took a vow. Call it ten years. >

 

-  Of course it matters.  The first year is all stars and romance.  If he loses her then, he'll be mourning a fantasy.  If he's been married ten years they'll have fought their way through the old 'Seven year itch' and be fairly stable.  Then he'll be missing a real person.   If they've been marries 20+ years then either she's the old ball & chain that he's just too lazy to shed, or they'er really entrenched in each other's lives and her loss would be emotionally crippling. 

 

 
"Why would a 25yo woman think a 50yo mage is a hottie?        Good question. But I see it all the time – on the ground as well as on TV. Women are drawn to men for different reasons than men to women – and the same, I guess. He’s got power and influence, and all the security and material wealth anyone could need – though it’s irrelevant to this story." 
 
-  That's a specific question, not generic.  What's the attraction between these two.  That will help us answer the questions.   What's the chemistry between A & B character. (you cover that more throughout these posts.)  
 
"He probably writes her a poem every other day. His memory of her keeps him breathing through the long winters."  
 
-  Well that pretty much clinches how he'd feel having an affair, doesn't it?     It would destroy life as he knows it.  A character who is a self-aware fifty is a little old to be jumping off that silky cliff.    
  
 
 
 
 
 
 


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Rob Mancebo
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   Posted 4/30/2008 7:06 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
MichaelEhart said...
I'm 52, and I'm still a hottie. My wife is 14 years younger than me and stunning.
At 52, believe me, I still enjoy a "physical relationship" :) --you know, shuffleboard, canasta, looking for my dentures.... sheesh. Go read Kinsey.

 
Kinsey?  Oh yes, the guy who proved he never passed statistical analysys by sending out 300,000 surveys, getting 3,000 back, then claiming to the world he knew all about everyone's sex life.  lol    (But he certainly had 'marketing' figured out.) 
 
-   I'm fifty this year and I've had to start having my wife come to lunch at work to chase away the 18year old girls.  But you can't judge every character by yourself.  I've seen plenty of pot-bellied, potato-nosed, bandi-legged, craggy, wheezy, apathetic, foul-tempered, semi-invalid, all-around physically disfunctional 50-year-olds.  I've also known folks who were active through their 80s.  
 
-  There are people who just physically and emotionally wither at that age, hence the question. 


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MysticWino
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   Posted 4/30/2008 7:01 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
She won't be around to raise the daughter . . .
And they are not in a progressive culture. On the other hand, it would likely come up with any publisher I sent it to. In the context of the fictional setting, I see no problem with it. In the context of markets . . . forget about it!
Besides, thinking on it now, it wouldn't suit her sense of competition. She's not brazen. She's actually a bit shy starting out. Okay. Definitely not that way. Of course, they might accidently drug themselves playing with alchemy . . .


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Rob Mancebo
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   Posted 4/30/2008 6:47 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
MysticWino said...
You've evidently read another of my stories with this ambiguity . . .
He's easy to drug. Makes his own wine and is fond of a certain intoxicating mushroom - though he also chews a mixture that keeps his head clear most of the time. The mushrooms are great pain killers, and he suffers from chronic pain. This reason has yet to be outed, though, as it is his most protected secret. At least protected most from others . . . He's not even aware at this point of the greatest secrets of his life, which he has hidden from himself for . . . a very long time.
I think I'll go with this, though it doesn't let him off the hook. He'll assume that he subconsciously wanted to be seduced and is therefore culpable. Guiltridden, he'll try to prevent the catastrophe he knows is meant to befall her. But that may be beyond the scope of this tale . . . no idea yet.
-  Wheeeew!  freaked   I can't believe you're going to slip him a "Date-rape" drug and call it good.  If you reversed the genders here you'd probably get any sales picketed by N.O.W.    And, of course, she's going to be okay with explaining to her daughter, 'Yes Honey, Daddy's not around because I slipped him a Mickey and had it on with him when he was unconscious.  You know, any way you can get 'it' is okay.'  ???? 
 
-  Now maybe I'm a little hyper-sensitive because I occationally deal with wandering psycho/perverts in my security job, but this doesn't seem like a good solution to me.  Sorry. 
 
 


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MysticWino
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   Posted 4/30/2008 5:52 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
You've evidently read another of my stories with this ambiguity . . .
He's easy to drug. Makes his own wine and is fond of a certain intoxicating mushroom - though he also chews a mixture that keeps his head clear most of the time. The mushrooms are great pain killers, and he suffers from chronic pain. This reason has yet to be outed, though, as it is his most protected secret. At least protected most from others . . . He's not even aware at this point of the greatest secrets of his life, which he has hidden from himself for . . . a very long time.
I think I'll go with this, though it doesn't let him off the hook. He'll assume that he subconsciously wanted to be seduced and is therefore culpable. Guiltridden, he'll try to prevent the catastrophe he knows is meant to befall her. But that may be beyond the scope of this tale . . . no idea yet.
Rob Santa said...
You can opt for the ranger in some way drugging your fellow that allows him to function while unconcscious. It might even add further to your story to have this child be his though he has no recollection of the act that created it. More moral connundra can ensue over that (did I have an affair or didn't I?).


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PaulMc
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   Posted 4/30/2008 5:03 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Rob Santa said...
The ranger's beauty compared with his wife's is unimportant. The moral conundrum of the title refers to how he feels about the potential affair. How does it affect his religion? How does it affect his marriage? It all centers around his belief system. If he believes he is still married, a tryst with this girl is an affair and wrong. If he believes he is unmarried, then it isn't. If he believes the tryst violates some premise of his religion, then it does. If he doesn't, then it doesn't (unless someone of higher authority in his religion feels otherwise, then it does).

I think Rob has valid points. It comes down to culture and religion and the guy's own moral compass. Odysseus spent years with Calypso and Circe, while Penelope fought off suitors. Yet, Odysseus is always touted as 'faithful' to Penelope. (I guess they considered heart and loins two separate fidelities ;-) Or they just had the usual double-standard)


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PaulMc
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   Posted 4/30/2008 4:50 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Jordan Lapp said...
My vote is that he sleeps with her, and then tells her that he has a raquetball game the next morning, so he's gotta get up early. Then after she leaves the cave, he loses her number.

[insert lyrics quotes from The Faces "Stay With Me" here]


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Jordan Lapp
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   Posted 4/30/2008 4:47 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Rob Santa said...
You can opt for the ranger in some way drugging your fellow that allows him to function while unconcscious.
Of course, this exact situation drove Lancelot insane...


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Rob Santa
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   Posted 4/30/2008 4:43 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
You can opt for the ranger in some way drugging your fellow that allows him to function while unconcscious. It might even add further to your story to have this child be his though he has no recollection of the act that created it. More moral connundra can ensue over that (did I have an affair or didn't I?).



Rob Santa
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MysticWino
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   Posted 4/30/2008 4:18 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
He is definitely not religious, though he is somewhat beholden to higher beings. He does have a code of ethics that is very demanding. But not rigid. In fact, his most rigid ethic is to remain flexible and deal with things rationally when at all possible. Love is the only ethic that binds him to his wife. To him it matters less that he finds no compunction in his own ideals to remain faithful other than the nagging belief that she remains true to him. Thus his ethic is reciprocity. And yet it is of some long range import that the ranger have a daughter before undertaking the adventure she thought was already underway . . . that crap happens when you get directions via a dead father in dreams ;-)


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Rob Santa
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   Posted 4/30/2008 3:21 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
The ranger's beauty compared with his wife's is unimportant. The moral conundrum of the title refers to how he feels about the potential affair. How does it affect his religion? How does it affect his marriage? It all centers around his belief system. If he believes he is still married, a tryst with this girl is an affair and wrong. If he believes he is unmarried, then it isn't. If he believes the tryst violates some premise of his religion, then it does. If he doesn't, then it doesn't (unless someone of higher authority in his religion feels otherwise, then it does).



Rob Santa
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MysticWino
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   Posted 4/30/2008 2:52 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Well, a lot of this won't show in the story. But it is important for me to know. The girl is not as pretty as the hermit's wife. Younger. More limber. She's kind of plain as far as features, though she does bost the high cheekbones he prefers. There is also the matter of his knowing her potential future. He's attracted to her as much for her place in the world and her fiery spirit as he is for her gymnast/acrobat body. Otherwise he'd just shrug and wander off to sublimate in study and scientific investigations - though in a very primative manner as we're talking dark ages technology level at this point, with a few sophistocated civilizations. In part, he's also superstitious that his wife somehow knows what he's up to despite their separation . . . He often makes the mistake of thinking that others know almost as much as he does.


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SJHigbee
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   Posted 4/30/2008 1:46 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
After 20 years alone??? Yes... strictly speaking, he is being unfaithful. But you can certainly present it as a totally forgivable lapse - particularly if your girlie is as ALLTHAT as I'm imagining. And afterwards, you can get shedloads of narrative tension as his hormones REALLY start zinging around & she's even more of a distraction as he initially feared...

Interesting scenario - hope it all works out!


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Jordan Lapp
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   Posted 4/30/2008 1:40 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
That's true, Michael, but there's 50 and then there's 50.


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MichaelEhart
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   Posted 4/30/2008 1:37 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I'm 52, and I'm still a hottie. My wife is 14 years younger than me and stunning.
At 52, believe me, I still enjoy a "physical relationship" :) --you know, shuffleboard, canasta, looking for my dentures.... sheesh. Go read Kinsey.


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