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| SFReader Forums > SFReader > Ask The Expert > Breaking new ground in S&S | Forum Quick Jump
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erazmus
Master
      
Date Joined Jul 2005
Total Posts : 4539
| Posted 4/3/2008 12:29 PM (GMT -5) |   | | | |
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nathan
Sage
Date Joined Mar 2006
Total Posts : 2122
| Posted 4/3/2008 12:31 PM (GMT -5) | |
Jordan Lapp said...So there's a lot of people who like Westerns on this board. I stand by the numbers. 3:10 to Yuma made 55 million at the box office. Compare that to "Wedding Crashers" a movie that had LESS star power at $209 million. Wedding Crashers was cheaper to make too. Do you see why filmmakers would rather invest in something other than a western?
No you're correct, I think. But I think Western is timeless because of the elements involved. So you can always have a "Gladiator" effect with a western. No one had seen a sword-and-sandal epic for like 30 years then you take the elements that make it popular and break it down then you get timeless and always capable of a resurge.
But there hasn't been anything big, big, in quite awhile I think this is true. Unless you count No Country For Old Men which is classic Texas Outlaws movie and huge but set in 1980.
Lonesome Dove was pretty big too, but that was awhile ago too. MY memory is going like my knee.
VIEW IMAGE"Writing the wet dreams of teenage boys" - Lindsey Llyod, Tangent Reviews
Tarantino himself has been forward and unapologetic about his influences. In a 1994 interview with Empire magazine, he said, "I steal from every single movie ever made. If people don't like that, then tough tills, don't go and see it, all right? I steal from everything. Great artists steal, they don't do homages." | | Back to Top | | |
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MichaelEhart
Sage
Date Joined Jul 2005
Total Posts : 2336
| Posted 4/3/2008 1:07 PM (GMT -5) | | SCIFICTION was actually making money, just not Hollywood standards money. Less than 100k a year was the same as losing money to those guys.
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RHFay
Sage
Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 1895
| Posted 4/3/2008 1:09 PM (GMT -5) | |
nathan said...What the hell do you mean "trying" you dirty SOB. Was I being obtuse. Are you saying I can't communicate in a written format!?! That's exactly what I'm saying. [I'm hitting quick reply so don't have my bouncing yellow tounge wagging laughing emoticons handy please mentally insert]. But, yes that's exactly what I'm saying along with fun = profit more than good = profit in many cases...and that that ain't bad or 'less' intrinsicly. Plus...we both like watching SciFi movies, lol.
Perhaps I'm being a bit thick today. I've got a lot on my mind at the moment, and I think my mind has turned to mush. I'm deliberately avoiding the "end of the quarter" work that I really need to get done (create tests, write up the third quarterly report, etc.). I should be doing that instead of posting on the forums, but...
By the way, you know my mother, then? (Bad, bad joke.)
"I'm going to do what the warriors of old did. I'm going to recite poetry!"
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nathan
Sage
Date Joined Mar 2006
Total Posts : 2122
| Posted 4/3/2008 1:19 PM (GMT -5) | |
RHFay said...
nathan said...What the hell do you mean "trying" you dirty SOB. Was I being obtuse. Are you saying I can't communicate in a written format!?! That's exactly what I'm saying. [I'm hitting quick reply so don't have my bouncing yellow tounge wagging laughing emoticons handy please mentally insert]. But, yes that's exactly what I'm saying along with fun = profit more than good = profit in many cases...and that that ain't bad or 'less' intrinsicly. Plus...we both like watching SciFi movies, lol.
Perhaps I'm being a bit thick today. I've got a lot on my mind at the moment, and I think my mind has turned to mush. I'm deliberately avoiding the "end of the quarter" work that I really need to get done (create tests, write up the third quarterly report, etc.). I should be doing that instead of posting on the forums, but...
By the way, you know my mother, then? (Bad, bad joke.)
I was teasing you for having the audicity to take my page long ramble filled with blind alleys and succinctly distilling it down to a sentence? You didn't think I was seriously calling you names in outrage did you? I thought I was being way over the top in an obvious manner.
If that wasn't clear then 1000 apologizes sir, I was saying "ya, you got it right".
VIEW IMAGE"Writing the wet dreams of teenage boys" - Lindsey Llyod, Tangent Reviews
Tarantino himself has been forward and unapologetic about his influences. In a 1994 interview with Empire magazine, he said, "I steal from every single movie ever made. If people don't like that, then tough tills, don't go and see it, all right? I steal from everything. Great artists steal, they don't do homages." | | Back to Top | | |
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Steven the Git
Acolyte
Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 213
| Posted 4/3/2008 2:39 PM (GMT -5) | | Yes I did mean the Searchers with John Wayne and it is a great movie. I have to say, I once tried coming up with top tens from various genres, and the western top ten stood out by miles. The Searchers, Unforgiven, The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (or throw in the entire trilogy), Warlock, The Wild Bunch, Once Upon a Time in the West, True Grit, Josey Wales, and there's more if I sat here and thought about it.
Hmmm, Blazing Saddles even?!
Also, on recent ones, there was the movie The Assassination of Jesse James. However that tends to prove Jordan's point, I'm sure it didn't do well money wise.
But big dumb easy going movies tend to outsell the better films. Most of the time people go out to enjoy themselves and want to watch Owen Wilson be funny, and not see something that will try to educate or make them think too much. A shame but we're kind of stuck with it.
I remember when two Wyatt Earp movies came out. One starred Costner and covered his life from his youth to his old age and was a very thoughtful movie. The other had Kurt Russell blasting people with a shotgun, which I really enjoyed. No prizes for guessing which was a hit though.
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Jordan Lapp
Top 5 Poster
Date Joined Sep 2006
Total Posts : 2806
| Posted 4/3/2008 2:43 PM (GMT -5) | |
Steven the Git said...
Yes I did mean the Searchers with John Wayne and it is a great movie. I have to say, I once tried coming up with top tens from various genres, and the western top ten stood out by miles. The Searchers, Unforgiven, The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (or throw in the entire trilogy), Warlock, The Wild Bunch, Once Upon a Time in the West, True Grit, Josey Wales, and there's more if I sat here and thought about it.
Hmmm, Blazing Saddles even?!
Also, on recent ones, there was the movie The Assassination of Jesse James. However that tends to prove Jordan's point, I'm sure it didn't do well money wise.
But big dumb easy going movies tend to outsell the better films. You're saying that Spaghetti Westerns are high concept? I mean, I love "The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly" as much as the next guy but... come on.... they were Cowboy-'sploitation (to coin a phrase).
Jordan Lapp
Managing Editor
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James Enge
Maker
Date Joined Jan 2006
Total Posts : 209
| Posted 4/3/2008 3:38 PM (GMT -5) | | | | |
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erazmus
Master
Date Joined Jul 2005
Total Posts : 4539
| Posted 4/3/2008 4:26 PM (GMT -5) | | | | |
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John M. Whalen
flashg
Date Joined Mar 2006
Total Posts : 422
| Posted 4/3/2008 5:14 PM (GMT -5) | | Thought I'd add a few thoughts to the discussion at this point.
A FISTFUL OF DOLLARS (1964) was a rewrite of Akira Kurosawa's YOJIMBO (1961). Which was a rewrite of Dashiell Hammett's novel RED HARVEST. The Leone and Kurosawa films were both existentialist films, which were popular during that period. The man with no name is an existential anti-hero, and the film definitely "broke new ground."
Peckinpah's masterpiece THE WILD BUNCH changed forever the way action movies are made. Peckinpah may also be responsible for killing off the western. After the Battle of Bloody Porch what more could you do?
Ridley Scott was quoted recently saying the western is dead. Maybe.But I'd hate to see a director like him even try to make a western. The Fords, Peckinpahs, Sturgises and Hawkses are gone. They were all men who made Hollywood and learned their trade by doing it. I don't think today's film school graduate director would even be capable of conceiving a western in the classic mold. Well, they might try to imitate favorites they've seen in class or on DVD. But the result wouldn't be the same.
The Western is basically a masculine genre. And there might not be enough of an audience left for it, given today's politically correct sensibilities. 3:10 FROM YUMA came and went, but don't forget BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN won Oscars. Talk about breaking new ground. Maybe that's the new direction needed for S&S. A barbarian who wears ladies underwear and plays the lute. | | Back to Top | | |
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James Enge
Maker
Date Joined Jan 2006
Total Posts : 209
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