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muskrat
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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 12:02 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Hi all--
Hope this post finds everyone well. 
 
Well, after writing a short I discovered that the theme of it is not altogether new, though I may have put a different spin on it. It's about an interstellar cattle drive, and I've found two places where these ideas have been explored, but in different ways. In some ways, I feel like everything has been done before and no more so that in sci fi and horror, since we have genre limitations. So what do you do, do you scrap it or send it? And if someone gets on your back about it? WWYD?  So much has been done in sci fi, how do you even keep track of it all? 

Muskrat
 
"Brain? What is brain?"  --Kara, giver of pain and delight, Spock's Brain episode 61
 
I'm not a trekkie but I love this episode

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MichaelEhart
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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 12:12 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
send it out.

Buy my book!
The Servant of the Manthycore available Nov. 17th from DEP
Illustrated by Rachel Marks, with an introduction by Michael Moorcock
Read me in 2007!
"The View From the Shotglass Floor" Ray Gun Revival, Feb 2007
"Voice of the Spoiler" The Sword Review, June 2007
"Servant of the Manthycore" The Sword Review, July 2007
"Darkling I Listen; and for Many a Time" Fear and Trembling, coming soon!
"Weaving Spiders Come Not Here" The Sword Review, August 2007
"Six Zombies Doing That Mick Jagger Strut" Damned in Dixie, Summer 2007
"Nothing But Our Tears" The Sword Review, September 2007
"Night of Shadows, Night of Knives" Magic and Mechanica, Fall 2007
"The Scarlet Colored Beast" The Sword Review, October 2007
"The Stars by Law, Forbidden" Unparalleled Journeys II, November 2007
"Who Comes for the Mother's Fruit" Every Day Fiction, November 2007
"Stand, Stand, Shall They Cry" Flashing Swords, November 2007
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nathan
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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 12:30 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.

Send it out. Send it to Space Westerns.com Send it to Spacesuits & Sixguns. You have no problem.

I was read a mystery where there was a murder. I liked it so much I got a different one. Yep, there was a murder in that one too. I read a third and I'll be damned, you guessed it.

You don't even have a shadow of a sembelance of a problem. The worse thing about it probablly your own feeling of dismay at realizing originality (as oppossed to innovation) is a bit of a will-'0-wisp dream.

VIEW IMAGE
"Writing the wet dreams of teenage boys" - Lindsey Llyod, Tangent Reviews
 
Tarantino himself has been forward and unapologetic about his influences. In a 1994 interview with Empire magazine, he said, "I steal from every single movie ever made. If people don't like that, then tough tills, don't go and see it, all right? I steal from everything. Great artists steal, they don't do homages."

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MichaelEhart
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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 12:39 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
To paraphrase a bumper-sticker "Write it like you stole it!"

Buy my book!
The Servant of the Manthycore available Nov. 17th from DEP
Illustrated by Rachel Marks, with an introduction by Michael Moorcock
Read me in 2007!
"The View From the Shotglass Floor" Ray Gun Revival, Feb 2007
"Voice of the Spoiler" The Sword Review, June 2007
"Servant of the Manthycore" The Sword Review, July 2007
"Darkling I Listen; and for Many a Time" Fear and Trembling, coming soon!
"Weaving Spiders Come Not Here" The Sword Review, August 2007
"Six Zombies Doing That Mick Jagger Strut" Damned in Dixie, Summer 2007
"Nothing But Our Tears" The Sword Review, September 2007
"Night of Shadows, Night of Knives" Magic and Mechanica, Fall 2007
"The Scarlet Colored Beast" The Sword Review, October 2007
"The Stars by Law, Forbidden" Unparalleled Journeys II, November 2007
"Who Comes for the Mother's Fruit" Every Day Fiction, November 2007
"Stand, Stand, Shall They Cry" Flashing Swords, November 2007
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Camille Alexa
fictionista



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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 12:41 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
nathan said...

Send it out. Send it to Space Westerns.com Send it to Spacesuits & Sixguns. You have no problem. ...


As much as I'm still annoyed by Nathan's recent self-admitted misogyny and insulting (to women editors) comments on another thread, he's absolutely right on this one.  I was going to recommend SpaceWesterns.com, myself.

Submission guidelines here:

http://www.spacewesterns.com/submissions/

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muskrat
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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 1:17 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Thanks so much! Yes, Nathan, you hit the nail on the head, and dang, I thought I was clever, but every good idea has had someone there before you. Thanks again for your good advice.

Muskrat
 
"Brain? What is brain?"  --Kara, giver of pain and delight, Spock's Brain episode 61
 
I'm not a trekkie but I love this episode

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RHFay
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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 10:53 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
camille said...
As much as I'm still annoyed by Nathan's recent self-admitted misogyny and insulting (to women editors) comments on another thread, he's absolutely right on this one.  I was going to recommend SpaceWesterns.com, myself.
I know this is off topic, but what's wrong with women editors anyway?  Many of my favourite editors to work with are women.

"I'm going to do what the warriors of old did. I'm going to recite poetry!" 
 
Richard H. Fay - Azure Lion Productions 
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Camille Alexa
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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 11:09 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
RHFay said...
 
... what's wrong with women editors anyway?  Many of my favourite editors to work with are women.

Exactly!  And why wouldn't they be?
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Rob Santa
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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 12:44 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Muskrat, I agree with the send-it-out sentiment. And on another thread smoewhere I mention how I wrote a story that was EXACTLY (really, exactly) like an apparently famous one I'd never heard of. My ending's better, but hey, that's writing. :-)

Ideas are not new (Francis Bacon said it first) yet your new spin on the story, and even the writing itself, may be what an editor needs to have in his/her publication.


Rob Santa
Hopelessly Addicted Writer of Speculative Fiction
and CEO of Ricasso Press

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Anaconda
Neophyte



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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 1:36 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
How can all the new ideas have been used up when science has not yet been exhausted?

Alec Anaconda, author of “Slaves of Janice” and “After Janice”.

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Lyn
Adopt



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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 3:11 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I know a woman editor. But in general, my philosophy is 'don't ask, don't tell.' ;-)
::ducks as all the women in this thread start throwing editorial thingys my way::

As to the thread at hand, ditto - 'send it out.' To someone it will be original.

Lyn from ResAliens

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MattDempsey
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  		   Posted 1/30/2008 3:58 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
If you have found the idea somewhere else but explored in a different way to your own, then what is the problem.

Write it, make it better than the existing tales you discovered and send it out.
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crystalwizard
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  		   Posted 1/31/2008 12:31 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Camille Alexa said...
Nathan's recent self-admitted misogyny and insulting (to women editors) comments on another thread,


Which thread was that?

>How can all the new ideas have been used up when science has not yet been exhausted?

The science is set dressing. The basic plots are told, retold and retold... and have been since people started telling stories.
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crystalwizard
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  		   Posted 1/31/2008 12:33 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Lyn said...
I know a woman editor. But in general, my philosophy is 'don't ask, don't tell.' ;-)
::ducks as all the women in this thread start throwing editorial thingys my way::

As to the thread at hand, ditto - 'send it out.' To someone it will be original.


*tosses chocolate cream pies at Lyn*

Even if it's not original, if it's written well it'll still be enjoyable to read and there will be someone, if not quite a few someones, out there that will want it.
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Camille Alexa
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  		   Posted 1/31/2008 12:39 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
crystalwizard said...
Camille Alexa said...
Nathan's recent self-admitted misogyny and insulting (to women editors) comments on another thread,


Which thread was that?

[...]
I wasn't trying to get anyone in trouble:  it had just been bothering me for a couple days and the above unfortunately slipped out.  I'm afraid I can't recall the thread, but it was a discussion about paying markets.  I'm sure he meant no lasting harm regardless of the oblique insult tendered.

 
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nathan
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  		   Posted 1/31/2008 12:56 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Oh...? The thread on pulp fiction? Was I attempting to be wry or sardonic and it came out flat? Or was I "trolling" right along? Do you have a link? Maybe I can explain context or apologize?

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"Writing the wet dreams of teenage boys" - Lindsey Llyod, Tangent Reviews
 
Tarantino himself has been forward and unapologetic about his influences. In a 1994 interview with Empire magazine, he said, "I steal from every single movie ever made. If people don't like that, then tough tills, don't go and see it, all right? I steal from everything. Great artists steal, they don't do homages."

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Camille Alexa
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  		   Posted 1/31/2008 1:17 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.

 

nathan said...
Oh...? The thread on pulp fiction? Was I attempting to be wry or sardonic and it came out flat? Or was I "trolling" right along? Do you have a link? Maybe I can explain context or apologize?

O Gawd no.  Please.  No explanations or apologies necessary, at least not on my account.  I'm afraid my hackles always rise when I hear the words "a" and "female" in conjunction, especially when used as a derogatory term or in a disparaging context.  So yes, it was probably the pulp thread in which this was a portion of the discussion:
 
 
"Then I read a few stories--maybe it was hard-edge lit, or grim lit or noir lit. Ah...no.

The first story was about a female reporter/photographer returning from Iraq with PTSD who reconnects with her distant, taciturn (read yucky male) father and learns to live again. Beautifully written Oprah fiction.

But it gets worse. That story at least had a war and war horrors referenced in it. This month's offering was about a grandfather who gets a laser procedure to make himself look 10 years younger.[...] >>

> >

...I feel betrayed and the misogynist (I guess) monster in my psyche can't help wondering (and in a really petulant voice no less) if maybe the new fiction editor is maybe...a female."
 
 
 
But please move on.  I don't want to waste any more time on this or hijack anyone's thread.
 

 
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nathan
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  		   Posted 1/31/2008 1:35 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Eh--I was trying to put it in a self mocking light for having a knee-jerk reaction. But I apologize. I'm always surprised when I discover people who aren't posting are reading, lol.

I've postulated before on the decline of male readership (as market force) and the (numerical) rise of women editors and how the content of Oprah's Book Club and say Heavy Metal Magazine, are a schism that exists. Also that in my experience women editors and the magazines they guide look for different things than what is called old school Men's Fiction.

But I meant it analytically--not as hate speech. Still I apologize. If it was nothing then it wouldn't have been carried around with you all this time. I hate to think I caused something like that without intending to--I was whinning about change. It's good discussion for the markets thread if you want. Otherwise sure, lets move on.

VIEW IMAGE
"Writing the wet dreams of teenage boys" - Lindsey Llyod, Tangent Reviews
 
Tarantino himself has been forward and unapologetic about his influences. In a 1994 interview with Empire magazine, he said, "I steal from every single movie ever made. If people don't like that, then tough tills, don't go and see it, all right? I steal from everything. Great artists steal, they don't do homages."

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muskrat
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  		   Posted 1/31/2008 4:16 AM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Well, I hope I don't get shot and skinned, but you could look at it this way. While it may seem that many more women than men are editors these days, it also seems that many more men get published than women, especially in certain genres. So it could be viewed that we are still in a way stuck in a role as "office staff" vs. "creative types". But these generalizations probably do no one justice and you could see that it may be more true in the bottom rungs of publishing that at the top, though I wouldn't know, but it tends to be that way in other fields.

I just don't watch Oprah and don't like Dr. Phil either, they both freak me out. They're really twilight zonish and I would end up tossing my tv out the window, and then I couldn't watch sci fi channel anymore. Stranger than fiction they are... Maybe I'd read a book if it were in Jerry Springer's book club (probably not though), or Quentin Tarentino's, or Emily Dickinson's, if she were still alive. I think such recommendations are best left to personalities like The Ghoul (if you're old enough to remember), the Cryptkeeper, and Elvira. But then I like Ed Wood movies.

Muskrat
 
"Brain? What is brain?"  --Kara, giver of pain and delight, Spock's Brain episode 61
 
I'm not a trekkie but I love this episode

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Gustavo
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  		   Posted 1/31/2008 2:01 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Haven't seen anyone shot and skinned here yet, but I do have two letters and one word for you, Muskrat: J K Rowling. I don't see women as cast in the office staff role. I see a lot of succefsul women writing successful books and stories. Yes, some genres attract more men than women, but the reverse is also true in other genres. And even in the extreme genres (the ones where gender readership is skewed to one side), like, say, chicklit and splatterpunk, the gap is getting narrower.
And you show extremely good sense in your reaction to Oprah and Dr. Phil!

Visit my livejournal!  http://bondo-ba.livejournal.com/ 

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Jordan Lapp
ppaL nadroJ



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  		   Posted 1/31/2008 2:06 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Rob Santa said...

Ideas are not new (Francis Bacon said it first) yet your new spin on the story, and even the writing itself, may be what an editor needs to have in his/her publication.
Actually, I believe it was first said in the Hebrew book Ecclesiastes (written something like 3000 BC)

Jordan Lapp
Managing Editor
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erazmus
Master



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  		   Posted 1/31/2008 6:55 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
We are not doing the male/female editors/writers thing again. Not at least until march.
Mike

Michael D. Turner
"Psyched Up" in _Turn the other Chick_-ed. E. Friesner-Baen books
www.baen.com
"Dutchman Rescue"in Continuum SF #6
www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm

"An Incident at Black Tongue Tavern" in _Bash Down the Door and Slice Open the Badguy_ from Fantasist Enterprises:

www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php
"Stains" in Tales of the Talisman 3-1 www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html
"Morning Coffee" in Every Day Fiction
www.everydayfiction.com/morning-coffee-by-michael-d-turner/
"The Jewel Below" in Flashing Swords
flashingswords.sfreader.com/issues/issue8/vol2-iss8-05.htm
"Happy Landings" in Every Day Fiction
www.everydayfiction.com/happy-landings-by-michael-d-turner/
"Teller of Tales" in Every day Fiction
www.everydayfiction.com/teller-of-tales-by-michael-d-turner/

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Jordan Lapp
ppaL nadroJ



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  		   Posted 1/31/2008 7:04 PM (GMT -4)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Good call, Mike. Thanks.

Jordan Lapp
Managing Editor
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