|
|
|
|
|
| SFReader Forums > The Real World > World Events > Congress hits low | Forum Quick Jump
|
 |  MichaelEhart Sage

       Date Joined Jul 2005 Total Posts : 2352 | Posted 8/8/2007 1:19 PM (GMT -5) |   | Ahhh Silverdrake, why do Bush supporters never allow him to take responsibility for anything, but blame everything in the known universe on Clinton? Wasn't the beginning of Bush's time self-proclaimed as the "responsiblity adminstration?" Bush gets extra blame for NCLB, which used fudged numbers to get passed and then was seriously underfunded. I disagree with every conservative back to Aristotle--- our kids are not less educated than the golden age of our youth, anymore than we were less educated than in the golden age of our parents or they theirs, ad absurbum. They just know a different set of useless crap. Spend a few moment checking out the WASL requirements for Washington State where I live. Could you graduate under those standards? I doubt I could. Read me in 2007!
"The View From the Shotglass Floor" Ray Gun Revival, Feb 2007
"Voice of the Spoiler" The Sword Review, June 2007
"Servant of the Manthycore" The Sword Review, July 2007
"Darkling I Listen; and for Many a Time" Fear and Trembling, coming soon!
"Weaving Spiders Come Not Here" The Sword Review, August 2007
"Six Zombies Doing That Mick Jagger Strut" Damned in Dixie, Summer 2007
"Nothing But Our Tears" The Sword Review, September 2007
"Night of Shadows, Night of Knives" Magic and Mechanica, Fall 2007
"The Scarlet Colored Beast" The Sword Review, October 2007
"The Stars by Law, Forbidden" Unparalleled Journeys II, November 2007
| | Back to Top | | |
 |  MichaelEhart Sage

       Date Joined Jul 2005 Total Posts : 2352 | Posted 8/8/2007 1:24 PM (GMT -5) |   | Would have been courteous of me to include the link, huh? http://www.k12.wa.us/assessment/WASL/MathTestItemSpec.aspx#2006 Sorry!
Read me in 2007!
"The View From the Shotglass Floor" Ray Gun Revival, Feb 2007
"Voice of the Spoiler" The Sword Review, June 2007
"Servant of the Manthycore" The Sword Review, July 2007
"Darkling I Listen; and for Many a Time" Fear and Trembling, coming soon!
"Weaving Spiders Come Not Here" The Sword Review, August 2007
"Six Zombies Doing That Mick Jagger Strut" Damned in Dixie, Summer 2007
"Nothing But Our Tears" The Sword Review, September 2007
"Night of Shadows, Night of Knives" Magic and Mechanica, Fall 2007
"The Scarlet Colored Beast" The Sword Review, October 2007
"The Stars by Law, Forbidden" Unparalleled Journeys II, November 2007
| | Back to Top | | |
 |  MichaelEhart Sage

       Date Joined Jul 2005 Total Posts : 2352 | Posted 8/8/2007 1:30 PM (GMT -5) |   | That being said, I do agree that I would like to see more history, civics, and geography being taught. This doesn't mean our education system sucks, it just means some curriculum tweaking. Critical thinking skills are important, too. After all, without a critical thinking vocabulary, what would we on this forum have to abuse? :) Read me in 2007!
"The View From the Shotglass Floor" Ray Gun Revival, Feb 2007
"Voice of the Spoiler" The Sword Review, June 2007
"Servant of the Manthycore" The Sword Review, July 2007
"Darkling I Listen; and for Many a Time" Fear and Trembling, coming soon!
"Weaving Spiders Come Not Here" The Sword Review, August 2007
"Six Zombies Doing That Mick Jagger Strut" Damned in Dixie, Summer 2007
"Nothing But Our Tears" The Sword Review, September 2007
"Night of Shadows, Night of Knives" Magic and Mechanica, Fall 2007
"The Scarlet Colored Beast" The Sword Review, October 2007
"The Stars by Law, Forbidden" Unparalleled Journeys II, November 2007
| | Back to Top | | |
 |  Silverdrake Stablehand

       Date Joined May 2006 Total Posts : 49 | Posted 8/8/2007 6:39 PM (GMT -5) |   | MichaelEhart said... Ahhh Silverdrake, why do Bush supporters never allow him to take responsibility for anything, but blame everything in the known universe on Clinton?
It's the same obsession, from my view. The left made fun of the right for doing it, now it's the left's turn to be made fun of for the same mental disfunction, s'far as I'm concerned.
MichaelEhart said... Bush gets extra blame for NCLB, which used fudged numbers to get passed and then was seriously underfunded.
It made an even bigger mess of education than was already there, causing schools to "teach the test" and ignore everything that's not on it. One net acquaintance has a straight-A student who was handed a C for a subject she never had in class. Required class for advancement, but they were always in another class being taught the test. Needless to say, the acquaintance, her husband and their daughter raised holy hell over it.
MichaelEhart said... I disagree with every conservative back to Aristotle--- our kids are not less educated than the golden age of our youth, anymore than we were less educated than in the golden age of our parents or they theirs, ad absurbum. They just know a different set of useless crap.
Knowing that a word is a root word and can be modified in many ways using prefixes and suffixes (each with their own meaning) is hardly useless crap. That is one thing that has been lost since I was in school. The 4 laws of basic math have likewise been lost. The students I see on my guard post don't know they even exist, and are amazed when I tell them that learning the medical math for their classes could be just as simple as finding and learning those 4 laws.
Useless crap, to me, includes brainwashing students into a certain political mindset by selective sorting of the facts intermixed with agenda-driven falsehoods. Forex, my son's Biology book states that global warming is caused by human pollution from petroleum use -- utterly ignoring that no such thing was in existance to cause the Medieval Warm Period, which preceded the Little Ice Age, from which world temperatures are only now recovering.
MichaelEhart said... Spend a few moment checking out the WASL requirements for Washington State where I live. Could you graduate under those standards? I doubt I could.
I'll give it a look. Getting ready for work, right now. Thanks for the followup link. Cogito cogito, ergo cogito sum. | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Silverdrake Stablehand

       Date Joined May 2006 Total Posts : 49 | Posted 8/8/2007 6:47 PM (GMT -5) |   | MichaelEhart said... That being said, I do agree that I would like to see more history, civics, and geography being taught. This doesn't mean our education system sucks, it just means some curriculum tweaking. Critical thinking skills are important, too. After all, without a critical thinking vocabulary, what would we on this forum have to abuse? :)
Heh. Critical thinking skills were something I had to learn on my own. They apparently were removed from school curriculums as a failed experiment back in the 50s. Seems the government thought it would be a really good idea to teach kids to parse Communist propaganda so they could see through it, and dang if the kids didn't turn right around and apply those same skills to the government's own propaganda! Oops! Couldn't have them doing that! So the skills were removed from the curricula.
But what you said about vocabulary goes right back to my previous post, in that kids aren't being taught any actual vocabulary, but some mish-mash of words with no relation to each other. "Whole word recognition" ends up with kids having some idea of how to get an idea across, but it sure as hell doesn't result in anything approaching clear communication. They thrown in whatever looks right, with no idea that what they wrote is completely different from what they meant. Hell, that was true 15 years ago. The instructor for the Editing for Journalism class I took spent the first two weeks of the semester teaching roots, prefixes, and suffixes. Most of the students had no idea that the latter two had any meaning of their own, or could be applied to any word except those they'd been taught already had them. Cogito cogito, ergo cogito sum. | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Silverdrake Stablehand

       Date Joined May 2006 Total Posts : 49 | Posted 8/9/2007 5:03 PM (GMT -5) |   | Okay, I've looked over the WASL requirements. The ones for 10th grade -- from what I can decode from the overly jargoned edu-speak -- are mostly what I was learning in 6th grade. The only things I saw that I hadn't covered in grade- or middle school pertained to the statistical evaluations. I don't recall those being covered in math class, per se, but rather taught as part of several subjects using examples from the topic under discussion, particularly in science and social studies classes.
For other comparison of standards: My father had correspondence texts from his early life (he had to work to support his family during his teens after his father was disabled). The math in those I never encounted before college, and they were, for their time, high school equivalencies. About 10th grade, iirc.
So I have to continue to disagree with your statement that current standards are just as good as those that earlier generations had to meet. The standards of my father's generation were far beyond those of mine, and the standards of my generation were far beyond those of today. Cogito cogito, ergo cogito sum. | | Back to Top | | |
 |  MichaelEhart Sage

       Date Joined Jul 2005 Total Posts : 2352 | Posted 8/9/2007 8:43 PM (GMT -5) |   | I'll see if I can stir up the sample test questions--- the standards are deceptive, as the actual questions are quite difficult. I just find it (logically speaking) difficult to believe that every generation since Aristotle has been less well educated. There is a vanishing point somewhere, and you would think that after over 2000 years of complaining about this we would have reached it. Yet, books are still written, the lights come on when you throw the switch, and the countryside is not ravished by migratory hordes of sub-literate prolls. Except in Oklahoma, of course. :) Read me in 2007!
"The View From the Shotglass Floor" Ray Gun Revival, Feb 2007
"Voice of the Spoiler" The Sword Review, June 2007
"Servant of the Manthycore" The Sword Review, July 2007
"Darkling I Listen; and for Many a Time" Fear and Trembling, coming soon!
"Weaving Spiders Come Not Here" The Sword Review, August 2007
"Six Zombies Doing That Mick Jagger Strut" Damned in Dixie, Summer 2007
"Nothing But Our Tears" The Sword Review, September 2007
"Night of Shadows, Night of Knives" Magic and Mechanica, Fall 2007
"The Scarlet Colored Beast" The Sword Review, October 2007
"The Stars by Law, Forbidden" Unparalleled Journeys II, November 2007
| | Back to Top | | |
  |  Scott Fazekas Stablehand

       Date Joined Sep 2004 Total Posts : 11 | Posted 9/4/2007 8:51 PM (GMT -5) |   | Very interesting and informative thread here, even if it has gotten off the original "Congress Hits Low" thread.
My two cents: for Congress to be effective, some changes would be required. For example:
1. Set strict term limits. Although I ignore polls in general, overwhelmingly they show Americans support the idea -- and Congress doesn't. Go figure. The big argument against term limits seems to be one of experience, ie, if the body politic is constantly replacing politicians, the Republic loses legislative and political expertise. But that's exactly what I want! I'd rather have a passionate amateur than a jaded "professional" in Congress.
2. Repeal the 17th Amendment to the Constitution. Have Senators elected by state legislatures, but rewrite the laws to prevent issues like 1850 Indiana etc. Let's level the Federal playing field some.
3. Accountability. If I'd engaged in misconduct at work, I'd have been prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Rightfully so. Congressmen and women who engage in misconduct, if and when found guilty, should be held accountable under the law. Period. And tossed out of office.
4. Meaningful campaign finance reform. A lot of this may be taken care of by point 1. above. Those parts of it that are not should be very closely controlled and monitored. It's not healthy for our Republic to have legislative elections so expensive that the average citizen has little chance of competing.
5. Protocol. Why should I, as an American citizen, be shoved to the back of the line by a Congresswoman or man? Why should these 'public servants' get front row seats, special privileges or treatment just by virtue of elected office? We're a Revolutionary Republic, f'cryin' out loud, where "all men (and women) are created equal." Drop all the red carpet treatment, and let 'em get a taste of standing in line at Maryland MVA for three hours just like me. NOTE: in ancient Sparta, the ruling kings would run when summoned to the citizen assembly, would rise when addressed by a citizen in a public forum, and fought in the first rank of the phalanx in wartime. How many Congressmen and women act like that?
Now, I think it was Daniel who made a comment about cracking a history book...we'd do well to pay attention to the examples of Athens or late Republican Rome here. Those ancients faced similar issues, at least on a macro scale, and were largely unsuccessful in resolving them.
Any bets on any meaningful reform in Congress happening soon? Doesn't matter a whit which party's in power. I feel like Churchill, who when voted out of office during WWII said "people tend to get the government they deserve."
V/R S Fazekas Aneriphthos kubos! "When asked by a Persian foreigner how far the boundaries of Sparta extended, King Agesilaus brandished his spear and said, 'as far as this can reach'." | | Back to Top | | |
        |  Scott M. Sandridge Former King of Shameless Plugs

       Date Joined Dec 2005 Total Posts : 714 | Posted 9/6/2007 2:10 PM (GMT -5) |   | | | |
 |  Scott Fazekas Stablehand

       Date Joined Sep 2004 Total Posts : 11 | Posted 9/6/2007 8:26 PM (GMT -5) |   | | Jeff, sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. Check out this website:
Just for fun, I watched "Mr. Smith Goes To Washington" this afternoon. I was possessed of two thoughts:
1. Hollywood would not make this movie today. First off, there's not one actor (not ONE) with James Stewart's credibility for that role. By this I mean, Stewart flew heavy bombers in WWII -- 25 missions over Germany -- and really did believe in this country. I take a look at the service records of and read statements by "actors" like Pierce Brosnan, Woody Harrelson and George Clooney, and I never want to see another movie made after 1980.
2. Congress is even more corrupt today than Frank Capra depicted it in the 50s. Take just the media for an example. Today, 8 huge conglomerates control between them:
--all the major daily newspapers
--almost all news magazines
--all the major broadcast networks
--most of the major cable broadcasters
--virtually all of the radio broadcasters
--most of the major book publishers.
These conglomerates are concerned primarily with making money. Why else do you think we get so many "news" stories on Lindsay Lohan and Princess Diana, and so few on the proposed merger of Sirius and XM satellite radio? It's because these conglomerates are beholden to advertising dollars, and advertisers don't want a well-informed, discerning public. And this all plays into Congressional hands, not just because of campaign contributions and lobbyist dollars but also because without press scrutiny, they can do damn well what they please. Have a look at all the pork John Murtha chows down on (Republicans are no different) and how little press attention it gets and you'll see what I mean.
Boy, am I on my soapbox or what? Even if no one is listening....
V/R S Fazekas Aneriphthos kubos! "When asked by a Persian foreigner how far the boundaries of Sparta extended, King Agesilaus brandished his spear and said, 'as far as this can reach'." | | Back to Top | | |
  | 45 posts in this thread. Viewing Page : 1 2 | | Forum Information | Currently it is Tuesday, January 06, 2009 7:48 PM (GMT -5) There are a total of 85,780 posts in 7,111 threads. In the last 3 days there were 20 new threads and 64 reply posts. View Active Threads
| | Who's Online | This forum has 1334 registered members. Please welcome our newest member, esbrown. 14 Guest(s), 1 Registered Member(s) are currently online. Details T A Markitan |
Forum powered by dotNetBB v2.42EC SP2 dotNetBB © 2000-2009 (c) SFReader |
|
|
|